Flip Houses Like a Girl Episode #12:

A $40K First Flip Profit Using a Home Equity Line of Credit with Kate Fulford 

Kate Fulford began her career life as a project manager for various marketing/design/software firms for about a decade. When the dot bomb fell, she decided to pursue her dream of opening a women's clothing boutique.

The shop was a colorful success in San Francisco, but when she got married and pregnant, they decided to move to Portland and she sold her store. 

After a few years off with her children, she opened a stationery boutique in Portland, but closed it after a year to pursue a career in Real Estate.  

She's been a broker for 6 years and just started flipping houses last Fall; she loves it all!

In this episode, she is sharing all kinds of things she learned as she navigated her first flip.

Listen and learn the following:

  • How she found and funded the deal
  • How she handled some unexpected surprises 
  • How she found her contractors 
  • The fears she felt around doing her first flip & how she overcame them 
  • What she's up to now

...and much more. Tune in now!


Visit Kate Fulford's Real Estate Brokerage website

Follow That Flip! Sign up to follow me and 2 local students as we flip a house together!  

3. Learn more about Debbie DeBerry | The Flipstress

4. Ready to get your First Flip Done Right and make at least a $25,000 profit, but you need help navigating all of it? We can get you there. 

5. Our goal is to hit 250 reviews and spread the good word about this podcast as quickly as possible!

Every 50 reviews, there will be a drawing! You can help us reach our goal PLUS have a chance to WIN Apple AirPods (they work with any and all devices, not just Apple!) by going to wherever you listen to podcasts, leaving a rating and review for the show, taking a screenshot of that submitted review and sending it to us at contact@theflipstress.com.

6. Continue the house flipping conversation in our free Women Flipping Houses Facebook group.

Full Transcript

Debbie: ( 00:00)
Hey, it's Debbie here. I hope that whatever you're up to today, you're having an easy one and the light one and a fun one. I am really excited about today's interview because it is with a woman who I spoke with initially in January of 2018 she said, Hey, I want to flip houses and guess what? She actually did the thing, she's on project and number three as of the time of this recording. So stay tuned and listen to Kate Fulford story about how she has navigated her first three flips.

Speaker 2: ( 00:41)
You're listening to the flip houses like a girl podcast where we educate, empower and celebrate everyday women who are facing their fears, juggling family and business, embracing their awesomeness and wholeheartedly chasing their dream of flipping houses. Each episode delivers honest to goodness tools, tips and strategies you can implement today to get closer to your first or next successful house flip. Here's your spiky-haired breakfast taco loving host, house flipping coach Debbie DeBerry.

Debbie: ( 01:19)
All right. I first talked to Kate in January of 2018 so fast forward, what, 18 months and now she has, she is about to list her third flip. She's awesome y'all. So she is in Portland, Oregon, which by the way is an expensive and tight market. So stop using those as excuses. Uh, she's a mom, she has two kids and a husband, and she's also a real estate broker. So she's busy and she's still making it work. It's all about your mindset and your priorities. So let's jump in here and listen to part of Kate's journey. I love it that we've come full circle. I do. I think it's really cool that we're getting to have this followup call two years later and you actually did the thing because a lot of people don't go do the thing. So

Kate: ( 02:20)
yeah, that's what it seems like. You know, like I'm a doer. I've always wanted to do or decide to do something. I do it. Sometimes it doesn't work out. Sometimes it does, but you got to go for it.

Debbie: ( 02:33)
I know. It seems so simple because I have that same kind of attitude and it's amazing how that attitude isn't the norm. It's like what's the difference there? It's very interesting. Yeah,

Kate: ( 02:47)
it is a really, really interesting, um, [inaudible] psychology. Yeah. Cause it's just stories we tell ourselves. So either you're telling the story like, Oh my God, I'm going to go

Debbie: ( 03:00)
for it. I can do it. And even if I don't succeed, it's fine. I learned something. Or you can say I'm scared. I don't think I can do this. And then you'd never do it. Exactly. Exactly. That simple. It really is. Okay. Do you want me to just jump in?

Kate: ( 03:19)
Yeah. So, um, do you want me to talk to you about my first flip?

Debbie: ( 03:24)
Yeah. Let's start with your first flip and like give us some details about it.

Kate: ( 03:31)
Okay. So you know, after talking to you, I mean, you really kind of hit me on the head of the right moment in time in terms of your ad showing up when I needed to see it.

Debbie: ( 03:46)
Isn't that crazy?

Kate: ( 03:47)
And then we had our conversation and I just decided this is exactly what I should be doing. I'm a real estate agent as you know. And um, I love decor and I love transformation and you know, I've owned clothing boutique in my life and I just like sort of dressing up, whether it's myself or somebody else or a home. And so it just felt like in my real estate career, which I love, I was missing a creative outlet and, um, and you know, designing flyers and stuff don't really count to me, although I do like to do that. So with the idea of flipping houses, insert my purview, I just got really, really jazzed. And after talking with you, I realized I have everything I need to do this and I'm just sort of laying down the groundwork. I met with several hard money lenders to talk about how they work and what I need to do to prepare. Um, and then I signed up for a lot of email lists or wholesale deals.

Debbie: ( 04:57)

Kate: ( 04:57)
And then of course I looked on the RMLS, which I sort of knew wasn't going to be where I found something, but I figured there's probably some, um, Jim is hidden in there somewhere. And um, and then I did other things like sending out a postcard to certain, um, houses that I picked that were looked dilapidated, mutated and that somebody had lived in for a really long time. And I tried, I tried different tactics, but ultimately how I found my first one is through a wholesale email that I received.

Debbie: ( 05:28)
Okay. You got the email,

Kate: ( 05:32)
they had an open house for one hour and offers, we're going to be due that night at five. So I arrive at this house, it's in a good neighborhood. It looked from the pictures, like it might've been immaculate, just badly designed or you know, bad finishes. And I arrived and I thought this house is darling from the outside. It looks immaculate. I don't even need to paint it. The doors, the bright red that I would do anyway, the roof looked good. Um, and I thought, okay. And then inside I could immediately sort of visualize some stuff I would change. Um, and so walking through there was probably about four or five other parties walking around, all with big, you know, trucks outside contractor types in here. And I show up in my little, my normal little car

Debbie: ( 06:29)
by myself.

Kate: ( 06:32)
I started, the owner was there that it was working with the wholesaler

Debbie: ( 06:36)
and I was chatting with her. I thought it was unusual too. Yeah.

Kate: ( 06:43)
She was a sweet, sweet old lady and she, her husband had passed away and she wanted to move back to San Diego to live with her daughter.

Debbie: ( 06:51)

Kate: ( 06:51)
And so, you know, she was just kinda hanging out and all this activities going on. And um, what was unusual about the situation also was that, and it, and it worked in, my benefit for this is that she wanted a rent back.

Debbie: ( 07:07)
So we close fairly quickly.

Kate: ( 07:09)
She wanted to stay there for awhile because she wasn't quite ready to move, which meant I got all this time.

Debbie: ( 07:16)
Yeah. To do, um,

Kate: ( 07:18)
contractor visits and get bids.

Debbie: ( 07:20)
That's crazy. I know. It's not normal. It's not. I knew and I knew it wasn't, I just felt like, yeah, I know that I'm getting really, really lucky right now. So

Kate: ( 07:36)
they told me no, several people were interested and that they were just going to pick the highest offer and you know, and it was priced pretty tight, you know, it was like on the edge of, you know, this is, this is the right price, but I really wanted it because I could tell this had the makings of a quick yeah. Relatively easy job. Yup. Um, you know, just flooring and surfaces and you know, and, and light fixtures and paint. And I thought, you know what, I'm, I don't care if I don't make the amount of money I should make on a flip, you know, according to all the books and everyone, everyone says, because to me, I just wanted to do one. I wanted one under my belt. I wanted the experience and even if I made $1,000, I was going to go for it.

Debbie: ( 08:23)
I hear that often, like really? But I think the goal of the first flip is to do it in a way that makes you want to do it again. That's the goal. Yeah. And it looks totally different to everybody. You know, like that looks different to everybody, but if you go in with that attitude, it's like, okay. And also it takes off a lot of pressure. Yeah. The perfectionism that we're all striving for usually. Absolutely.

Kate: ( 08:52)
Yeah, exactly. So, you know, despite all the books saying, you need to make this percentage and not manage and blah, blah, blah. I just said, you know what, I am going to make money on this. I can just tell and I'm just going to go for it. And so I bought it, or let me look this up cause I forgot exactly how much I spent on it. I bought it for four 65 100. What was the asking price? You know, I kind of, I think it was four 60 it wasn't, I didn't go that much over. Yeah. Okay. And I thought, yeah, some people are gonna go for what it was. Um, some people are gonna go four 65, you know, somewhere between there. And I'm just going to add that hundred. I love it. That helps me. And it worked. I don't know what other people offered. I never found out, but I was like, okay, I'm going to go for this. And I was planning the list it around five 65. Okay. And, um, okay. So I, um, my budget was 25,000. Okay. Wow. It's nice to do work. Yeah. And um, I'll tell you this, I don't know how this happened. I feel like I actually have some weird knack knack for this because the budget came in at 25,000, $207 74, seven.

Kate: ( 10:20)
Say I had issues come up. I just shifted, you know, I made choices that, and I'll tell you this, when, when I started having contractors and they give me bids and um, I had this idea, I'm going to knock down the wall between the kitchen and the dining room and open it up because I know people love that look. And then it had, um, you know, I just felt like that would be a great way to manage the bottom floor. And I started getting, you know, people are like, well this is, you know, you can only cut out the middle of the wall is this is, these walls are structural. And I was like, okay, I don't want to, my goal was I don't want to have to pull a permit for anything. I just want to do cosmetic work. I don't want to be delayed.

Kate: ( 11:04)
Right. Cause I'm trying to get this done like in a month, right. With my timeline. And um, so I made a lot of choices. You know, I realized like, okay, even though this could be cool, it's not necessarily gonna pay for itself. Right. I'm still going to list their house for the same amount of money. It's not going to add necessarily that much more value having this open. So I just kept making decisions like that I had to reign myself in, cause I start out with these grand ideas and then I'd say, Nope, I don't need to do that. I really don't need to do that. And so I was gonna read, there was a lot of hardwood, original hardwood floors on the second floor, which were great. I just kept those as is [inaudible]. Um, the main forehead giant, um, red brick tile in a herringbone pattern that look almost like an exterior.

Kate: ( 11:58)
Oh, Kyle. Yeah. And um, and I thought, Oh my God, this is gonna cost a lot to, to rip up, but I want to put hardwood floors in here and the kitchen has like old gross vinyl and one of the contractors, you know, some of them were bidding, giving me bids for that and one of the guys said, why don't you just put down LVP right on top of this? And I was like, what? Tell me more about that. Okay. Cause I didn't really know a lot about it and he's like, yeah, you can just put this flooring right on top. There's a million different choices out there. They look a lot like woods or durable. They're waterproof. And I was like, I'm sold on this. And so I ended up saving a lot of money out of my own ideas, you know, by going what's a smarter idea.

Kate: ( 12:43)
Yeah. Um, but the thing I probably could've got this done quicker, but one thing, um, okay, in the kitchen, you know, at this price range in the, in the, you know, over a little over a half a million. I really wanted to put nice quartz countertops. Right. And so that took the longest of anything just having that, you know, cause I bought him an Ikea during there, their kitchen sale. And so it took everything took a little bit longer, so longer to have the template made to have the installation. And so that was sort of what drove the entire timeline for the countertops. Wow. Everything else would've got done quickly and easily. And um, you know, I had some surprises. For example, there was a couple of deck boards on the back deck that were rotted and when my contractor started taking those off, you found out that a lot of the structure underneath was rotted. So he said this whole thing needs to come out. Like what budget for a new deck.

Kate: ( 13:43)
You know, I really carry member like what I, I've maybe I was going to come in under budget or something. I can't remember what I, what I changed to do that. But that was kind of the biggest, biggest little issue that came up. And then a couple minor [inaudible] um, light fixtures situations. For example, this person who owned the house has literally every single light fixture, multiples in a room were ceiling fans and there was an AC. Wow. It was a little bit of overkill and I'm fan of the ceiling fans, especially dated ones. So I was going to take all of those out and put in really cool light fixtures. [inaudible] and one of 'em was not hooked up to a switch cause cause it ran on a remote. So it was just wired directly into the fixture. And so that, you know, at the last minute, that was one of the last things. And then I had to cut into the wall and get the drywall repair and the paint. You know, so a couple things, silly things like that happen that I did, I didn't account for, but I'm, I was very, and then I listed it for five 59. Um, and I ended up getting, um, let me look, let me go back. I got five 69 K over asking offer. Awesome. And yeah. And I ended up netting, you know, after the hard money cost and all that, um, about 25 little over $25,000.

Debbie: ( 15:15)
That's awesome. For a flip that required 25 grand in work. That's amazing.

Kate: ( 15:22)
Yeah. I've, yeah, it was quick. It was basically, I, Oh no, I did this work and about a month I got an offer in a, in about 12 days. Then there was, you know, you're standing close. Okay. Must grow time. Right. And so I felt like this is, this is, and plus I got a commission off my time.

Debbie: ( 15:41)
Right, right. So does 25 K include the commission?

Kate: ( 15:47)
No, that sounds, and then I got the commission on top of that. Wow.

Debbie: ( 15:52)
That's awesome. So really, so, yeah. That's awesome. That's awesome. See I think real estate agent, it'd be flipping houses.

Kate: ( 16:03)
I'm really, I know everybody that I know is like, wait, can I talk to you about this? Can we, can I take you out to Colorado? I'm like, sure. Yeah, absolutely. Cause I ended up making a little over 40 grand on this. You know, I figured if I could do three of these a year, that's great.

Debbie: ( 16:19)
Exactly. Thank you for saying that because I feel like a lot of people have an idea in their mind that they have to flip a ton of houses each year and that sounds exhausting. I don't want to flip a ton of houses each year. I'm beyond that. I'm like in, you know, kid and I want time freedom and all of the beauty that comes with being self employed. Um, so yeah, it's like no, you don't have to flip that many houses a year. Even if right. You do one, an extra 40 grand is a pretty sweet page heyday. Like that's a pretty nice bonus for them.

Kate: ( 16:58)
Very sweet.

Debbie: ( 16:59)

Kate: ( 17:00)
I couldn't agree more. And plus if it's something that you totally enjoy, like I had so much fun doing this and I learned, yeah, so much and I just feel every time I do when I'm on my third right now it's going to go live next week. I feel so much more confident and I, you know, I've now I'm knowing where, where to cut costs and we're not to, and I, you know, there's always some random hodgepodge thing that comes up that I have to like come up with a solution for and, and you just, it's fun. I liked being on the project.

Debbie: ( 17:34)
Yes. I love the problem solving piece. I think it adds like a nice, um, layer that isn't just the aesthetics. It's like, yeah, yeah. Okay. Now I get to, I get to solve this puzzle. Um, okay. That is super awesome. Now did you, so you've been an active real estate agent, I think you're active for about six years, right?

Kate: ( 17:57)
Yeah, I'm, I'm on, gosh, I'll be starting my seventh year shortly.

Debbie: ( 18:02)
Okay. Did you start flipping just because you wanted to try it or are you trying to wean yourself from clients or, or what exactly or did you just want to try it?

Kate: ( 18:16)
Good question. Um, well, like I said, I wanted to add, uh, like a more creative aspect to my career.

Debbie: ( 18:22)

Kate: ( 18:23)
But I also think that this was a nice way to sort of hedge. I'm not, I'm a [inaudible] I'm basically a part time real estate agent because I have two young kids and I try to work around the sketch. You know, I try to work while they're at school

Debbie: ( 18:37)
for sure.

Kate: ( 18:38)
Exactly. Yep. And you know, and I've, I have to do certain things on weekends and evenings now and then, but I'm not trying to be, you know, some superstar agent who's got a gazillion deals going on. Right. That's not my vibe. That's not how I work. I only work with referrals. I'm not out there marketing myself and doing all this stuff because I don't really wants, want to be that busy.

Debbie: ( 19:00)

Kate: ( 19:01)
But I wanted to boost my income and I think this is something I have complete control over. Like I don't know when someone's going to buy or sell their house that I know it just, these things just pop up randomly. And I stayed pretty busy year round. Um, and you know, I'm happy with that part of my business but I just wanted to turn up the volume and so to me this was a way to do that and um, and do something that I thoroughly enjoy. And I also thought it was sort of hedge time, you know, time's coming up that might, where the real estate business might take a turn. Right. And if I can be doing something like this, you know, when the market squeezes, then that'll be

Debbie: ( 19:46)
cool. Totally. I think it's so, I [inaudible] ever since I started flipping what, Oh gosh, 11 years ago, I think I, it's like every agent I talked to, I'm like, you need to be flipping houses. You have like you are in prime position and not just because you have access to all this data and knowledge and experience and stuff, but because it's smart to have multiple streams of income. If you're just relying on brokerage income, then the faucet turns off and what are you going to do? Like it's just, it's so, it feels stressful to me to, to operate that way. So I'm super excited for you. So you're on flip number three now.

Kate: ( 20:34)

Debbie: ( 20:35)
Did you buy your second and third flip from wholesalers as well?

Kate: ( 20:40)
Okay, my, let's see. Let me look it. Um, yeah, my second slip, um, which I turned, which I bought this last spring and sold, or at least summer was um, a pocket listing. Oh, I'm, I got it. I got an email forwarded to me from a colleague who, you know, agent from another office had sent him and I said, Oh, it was a couple of going through a divorce and their house was just hoarding, kind of hideous mate, no maintenance nightmare. And they just wanted to kind of get their money and go without having to deal with each other. And without having to deal with fixing up the house. Yeah. So I went and looked at it and I thought, okay, this, this is a good, this has a lot of potential. And I um, but I ran the numbers and the, and the price they're asking, it wasn't going to work for me.

Kate: ( 21:38)
So I said, no, I'm going to, I'm going to pass on this one. So then, um, cause several other agents were gonna look at it too. And then he called me back about a week later and said, you know what price would work for you? And I told him and he said, I think I can make that happen. So we got into a contract and because it was sort of a normal contract, I didn't have to use the one page wholesale kind of scary situation. My forms that I'm already using manage it as if it was a regular transaction. I did it full inspection. Nice. Um, yup. And I found out the roof need to be replaced. So I said, I want to, I want to lower the price because the roof, you know, there's mold up there. There, you guys have had leaks and I Linda dah dah dah and it's, we might have to replace a lot of the plywood and that's an unknown and I don't want to take that risk.

Kate: ( 22:30)
And so I got a big price reduction. Right. Nice. And then I might, I was able to do the roof for less, so that was nice. Okay. But you know, and I learned the one, a big learning that I had on the first one, um, was the woman left a bunch of crap, like weird stuff. I mean it was basically cleaned out but she left like a super heavy desk in one of the bedrooms upstairs and she left like an old giant um, non flat screen TV. Oh gosh. In the garage. All this stuff was in the basement that I had to deal with in that someone who lived there used to work on cars. So there was all these like auto parts type things in oil and all this weird stuff. It costs me a lot of money to get rid of that crap.

Kate: ( 23:23)
And, I mean, I was posting stuff on next door, like, come on over and walk through my basement and take whatever you want. People were taking stuff, but I still had to deal with getting rid of heavy items that had to be moved out. So on this next house, when I saw that these people were definite hoarders and there was a ton of crap everywhere and I thought they're going through a divorce, they're just gonna leave their crap and I don't want to deal with it. So I've made it. I wrote it into the contract that every single personal item must be removed before closing. And it was a good thing because there was, um, yeah, there was a lot of crap and I felt like I could start working without dealing with that. Right. So that was a nice thing to learn. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Debbie: ( 24:13)
So on your first flip, you, did you finance everything through a hard money loan or did you have to use some of your own money?

Kate: ( 24:25)
Well, the way I did it and the way I've been doing all of these is hard money. I found a hard money lender that will loan me, um, 90% of the, of the, of the price of the house. Yup. And I need to only put 10% down and then they charged me and abhorrence 16% interest. But no point being a better deal paint cause I'm trying to use the round so quickly. You paying three? I'm prepaying three months. I've so far on both of them I've gotten money back because I, I sh I closed within three months.

Debbie: ( 25:05)
Yeah. That's awesome. I'd much rather pay 60% interest at no points.

Kate: ( 25:10)
Right. Because I did the numbers and were, I would pay more and if this was like a six month project or something, I'd probably do it the other way. But my guy even told me if you're your chair, if it's four months or less, you're better off doing 16% and then the repairs I do myself because I don't want to deal with having to submit receipts and all this kind of crap. I just want to kind of do it myself. And I've been using my hilar on my home with my own money. Nice. I've just been using the hard money in the Haylock.

Debbie: ( 25:42)
That's awesome. That's so smart. Tapping into money that is just sitting there. Yes. Yeah.

Kate: ( 25:48)
That's so cool. I love it.

Debbie: ( 25:49)
Yes. Yes.

Kate: ( 25:51)
I realize I could do that. Like, you know, years ago I remember somebody saying, you should flip houses because they just like my, my style and my before. And I thought, Oh, well how could I do that? I don't have hundreds of thousand dollars dollars. Right. But I, you know,

Debbie: ( 26:06)
well, and then

Kate: ( 26:07)
come to the realization like, yes, you can.

Debbie: ( 26:09)
Yes. But then when people start saying, well, you can do this for no cash out of pocket, it's like, okay, that sounds scammy. And it's like, no, it's really not. Like you really can. Yeah.

Kate: ( 26:19)
You really truly can.

Debbie: ( 26:21)
Yeah, I know. That's so funny. Um, okay. That's awesome. I love that. I love that you're doing it that way. And then did you act as your own GC or did, did you have a GC managing the project?

Kate: ( 26:34)
I acted as my own. I had, um, we did a, uh, bathroom addition in my house, um, a few years ago, and I hired GC who was a woman and, um, and who I loved. And I designed it, you know, I picked out all the finishes and everything and she, and I actually hired my own plumber just cause I liked him so much, but she, you know, she had everything else and she gave me the timeline and the budget. And, um, I was, you know, obviously there every day watching this happen and I just learned from this and I thought, well, I could do this, right. I know the order that things need to go in, you know, and the bathroom pretty much the most complicated thing, you know, except for a kitchen. Um, and so I thought, okay, yeah, I think I could manage this myself. And I, you know, I work with a large network of contractors as a real estate agent, right.

Kate: ( 27:29)
But, um, I have a plumber I love. Um, I found a handyman on next door who ended up being a great member of my team and he could kind of just do anything. And then I, um, I've found a contractor was like the guy who did my floor and the tile, he was a guy from my network at work and now he's my main guy. Like I call him on everything. And if I, if I'm even considering buying a house, I have him come out with me and he goes over [inaudible] you know, what, what we could do. And he was one of the smart ones when I was bidding out my first job, who said I wouldn't do that for and I would do this and you know, you've saved me so much money by just giving me a better solution. And so I really trust him. And he also would say like, I don't know if you need to take down this wall.

Debbie: ( 28:25)

Kate: ( 28:25)
And then I ended up just coming up with a fun solution that made the house look super cute. Um, but yeah, so I feel really confident in the team that I've assembled and so far everyone's working great. Oh. And a painter I found on a Facebook group called mobs, which his mom owned businesses and she was, she was just starting her business with her husband and she's been like, she's been with me on every flip now too. I feel like the prices are great. I trust her, you know, you know, it's just so nice to have a team that I like and they liked me and that want to do good to do great work at great prices. And I just feel, cause that's one thing that also can stop people. I think it's like I don't know anybody who would do the work. And when you have your team, it feels so good. Yep.

Debbie: ( 29:19)
Absolutely. Yeah, I totally agree. And also I, I don't think it's as hard as a lot of people anticipate it being. If you ask around, like ask people for recommendations, ask realtors, please ask realtors because we, that's, we have to know these things. We have to give our clients recommendations

Kate: ( 29:42)
of vendors and stuff. So I think realtors are, it's so smart to ask realtors for those things, but maybe I'm just, yeah, absolutely. And I mean, look at the hodgepodge places I've been. I found some of my fellow calls, I found some online who are like my main, and then one guy, my plumber is my cleaning lady's husband, you know, and so he's just great. He knows me well. He, you know, we've been, we've known each other for years and you know, they're just such great people and I know I can always trust him. And he's, he also comes up with great, clever solutions to problems where other people want to jackhammer things and do all kinds of crazy expensive stuff. And he's like, well, why don't you just do this? It's like something very only 10 simple. And what I like about contractors when they come up with simple, less expensive solutions,

Debbie: ( 30:33)
right. Save me money and make it look great. Completely. Um, are you focusing on certain areas of Portland or are you going with basically if a deal looks good, are you looking at the numbers or are you looking for deals in specific areas? Does that make sense?

Kate: ( 30:58)
Yeah, I am. I'm kind of looking for deals anywhere in Portland, um, because it's still [inaudible] pretty hot market. We're in the sort of closest Metro area. Um, what I find is that I put the limit I put on myself is how long does it take you to drive to this house? Because, you know, as a realtor I drive around enough. I don't want to because sometimes I'm there every day checking in or doing a little something and um, I don't want to waste a lot of time driving to something that's a little too far away. So there's about a 15 minute drive limit I've imposed on myself. Cause there's, there's some outlines, city areas around Portland that could probably be a gold mine for some really cool projects. Yeah. But they might be a half hour drive each way and then you add traffic and I could get stuck out there and I just don't want to deal with that.

Kate: ( 31:56)
Yup. So I tried, I mean I, I was looking for at one, um, before I, the one I'm doing right now popped up and just ended up being such a good deal. I decided to go for it, but I was costing out one and sort of watching it and trying to figure out, it was listed on the RMLS and um, I was going to do a low ball offer on the market for a really long time and I have my numbers put together and it was a place like of walks too from my house. Oh gosh. And I really liked the idea of it being that close, but it's now I thought, well, if it's still available after I finished this one, maybe I'll consider it. Um, but it's gotten pending so somebody else's gonna fix up. But that's fine.

Debbie: ( 32:41)
So, okay. So the first one you found through a wholesaler, the second one was, um, an off market listing with or a pocket listing with a realtor. And what about this third one?

Kate: ( 32:51)
This one is also from a wholesaler, a different wholesaler.

Debbie: ( 32:54)
Okay. So, so there are deals out there. Anyone who's listening to this, there are deals out there. The wholesalers, are you finding, is it the same wholesaler that you bought the first one from or a different one?

Kate: ( 33:08)
No, it's a different one.

Debbie: ( 33:11)
Are you finding that they are accurate in there numbers and are there, are there the prices that they're asking for these properties? Are they pretty reasonable?

Kate: ( 33:23)
Well, that's a good question because what the one that I bought the first one from, they always put together a little [inaudible]. They'll say, you're surprised. Here's the repairs you need to do. And it'll say like roof X dollars, sorry. Next sellers window, you know, they'll let, they'll itemize everything and then put the ARV and how much you would make. And then they put together a pro forma and it's usually, I think way off.

Debbie: ( 33:49)
Yeah. Yeah.

Kate: ( 33:52)
They are B is sometimes way over the price to do everything is way under and they always assume that you're going to sell it in 30 days and not necessarily going to happen in 30 days anymore. The market has shifted. So, um, so I always have to adjust everything. But this, the person that I bought the most recent one from, he doesn't include any of that. You got to do that yourself. Uh huh. And it was kind of a gut thing. You know, I just, I think it's a unique, I mean the property is not perfect. It's got some issues that may come up on the bedrooms or pretty small. But what I like about it and what I know a lot of people are looking for [inaudible] is it has a little basement apartment. So somebody could live in the upper level, which is a three bedroom, two bath, two full bath, and then it has the two bedroom full bath apartment with a separate entrance and its own little kitchenette. And, um, so I thought people look this idea because they can Airbnb it, pay for their mortgage

Debbie: ( 35:00)
all day long. That sounds like a golf golfer.

Kate: ( 35:04)
This, I know this might even, I mean my husband and I like, should this be a buy and hold it, you know, and if it doesn't sell for what I want, then I'll, then I'll go down that path. But, um, I just kind of, you know, the interest is so high and um, yeah, I don't know if I want to deal with it, but, um, anyway, so that's, it was this how a unique feature that I felt like and I, and I could just, any house I look at and I look at, you know, a decent amount, not a ton come, come by [inaudible] my um, computer that that could work. But I'm, when I do check them out, I need to be able to sort of visualize what I'm going to do.

Debbie: ( 35:47)

Kate: ( 35:47)
I can walk in and be like, Oh yeah, I can show this, this, this is going to be awesome and this is all I need to do. And if I walk in and I'm like, I don't know what the hell to do with this,

Debbie: ( 35:57)
right. Total my hair, I can't even, my brain can't even wrap around what I would do with this, then I just close the door and walk away for you. I think that's like, honestly, I think that's one of the biggest lessons people have to learn is to walk away. Just walk away. Be okay with not every deal working out as much as you want it to. And as much as I want it to for you, you've gotta be willing to walk away.

Kate: ( 36:24)

Debbie: ( 36:25)
Oh, that's hilarious. That's so funny. Um, so I guess I have a couple of questions. One is, okay, has your husband Ben totally supportive the whole time or is he a little bit more risk averse?

Kate: ( 36:40)
No, he's, he's very supportive. Any, any, he knows. I mean, he's not the handiest dude and neither am I. I mean, I basically don't do anything myself. There's a few minor things and I'm picking up some new skills on this new one. But, um, he, like, he, he wants, his goal is that he and the kids both contribute somehow to each of my flips. And so the kids on the first one came and they helped me rake up a bunch of leaves in the backyard and lay out some mulch. And then, uh, you know, my husband will do, you know, little things like, you know, hanging some towel bars and like changing out the door knobs and you know, kind of small handyman stuff that, you know, he can just do. Um, so this not this one that I'm working on. Yeah, I like it too. I like the, cause he's busy with his own career so he doesn't have a ton of time to help me out. But he, but he really wants to, he doesn't want one to go by where he doesn't actually do some work on it.

Debbie: ( 37:41)
So sweet. He'll be doing,

Kate: ( 37:43)
we're going to do the finishing touches this weekend. Um, you know, just put it up. Things like towel bars and there's one more door knob to change out and I need to finish. I'm doing something unusual. Um, um, this one and what, what I discovered on my second flip was, okay, Gaia found on Facebook. Again, I find people in unusual places. He does this really cool epoxy coding on top of an old countertop.

Debbie: ( 38:13)
Oh my gosh. Yeah. Right. And it looks like court. Yes. Yeah. And it cost $300. Right.

Kate: ( 38:24)
I'm in love with this idea. It looked amazing. Everyone was like, what is this? Oh my God, I love this. And it looks looked so sharp. So I thought, Oh, of course I'm going to use him on this, this current flip. And I had the two kitchens to do. So, you know, I had them all scheduled on the day that he was coming in and I told them, just do exactly what you did on that last flip. I loved the color. It was perfect. Um, and he said, okay. And I sent him pictures and he comes in and he calls me and he says, um, I can't do my coding on these countertops. And I said, what, why? And you said, well, because the, for Micah, the layer on top is there's been some damage and it's lifting up from the, the sub layer. And, um, so my, I just can't guarantee my, I'm, I'm not going to be able to do it. Like he just said it just who knows what kind of problems could come up. And so he said what you really need to do is just replace these. And I was like a what? Yeah.

Kate: ( 39:29)
Some of the hideous choices they have that I can get today because otherwise, you know, I can't custom order anything because it's too late. So I just, I took a leap of faith on the, you know, I had already painted the cabinets like a pale gray and I was gonna do gold hardware. So I found something on home Depot. I literally haven't seen it in person who's installing it today. It has some kind of grayish, whitish grayish and I'm hoping it looks good. Okay. Um, we'll see. Cause I just had to like give up my idea of exactly how it would look and be like, it'll be fine. It'll be totally fine. And then the basement, I was doing black counter, uh, black cabinets and I wanted it to kind of have this cool hip vibe, you know, cause it's going to be an Airbnb most likely.

Kate: ( 40:17)
And I didn't think that countertop would look good with the black. So I thought, what the hell can I do here? The tiny little kitchen, it's only an eight footer. There's no, um, stove or anything. Um, and I said, you know what, I'm gonna, I've been also following on Facebook of a paint called heirloom traditions that people use to paint cabinets. It's all in one. And I used it and I really like it and it did a beautiful job when the cabinets. And so I thought, I'm going to freaking paint these countertops black and the whole thing's going to be like a sexy black kitchen. Oh cool. I want to see pictures of that. I will show you. I did one coat and I was like, this is going to work because people are doing it and they're, I'm on a Facebook group where people are showing their projects. I just looked up black countertops and I saw this woman did it and I thought, damn, that looks good. She said it worked great. And I, so that's what I'm doing. That is super cool. Never, I haven't heard of that. Yeah. It's an experiment. So I thought, well, the worst thing that could happen is if it doesn't work, I can use that same kind of crappy other one or you know. Yeah. No, it won't look as good.

Debbie: ( 41:33)

Kate: ( 41:33)
exactly. If

Debbie: ( 41:34)
it doesn't work, make a different decision, it'll be fine. Yeah. I love that you're willing to experiment.

Kate: ( 41:40)
Yeah. That's all kind of fun. I, and I thought if I, if this works, then there's an even less expensive solution. Right. I don't think I would use that maybe in the main house and the, you know, it's probably like, uh, I probably wouldn't use something that sort of, um, solution very often. Yeah. But if it works in this first for little things like this, that might be great. Yeah.

Debbie: ( 42:05)
So did you have any kind of fears or anything like any sort of limiting beliefs? Like, I can't do this, I wouldn't be successful at it or I'm too scared. Or did you have anything mindset wise that was all holding you back?

Kate: ( 42:26)
Um, I don't think anything was holding me back because I, I sort of have, like I said, I'm sort of a natural risk-taker. I've opened a couple shops in my life, you know, I sort of like when I didn't get into the college, I wanted to, I, I didn't take that for a no for an answer and I wrote him and told him I was coming and to figure it out. So I don't know, like here it out where if I want something I make it happen and I'm, that's just kinda how I am. Yup. And, um, but that doesn't say I didn't have fears. I mean, there's certain nice felt lie awake just going, Oh my God, what if this, what if this? And like if I don't get an offer right away, I freaked out and like, Oh my gosh, Oh, what if I lose it? But it doesn't stop me from doing it, doing it. I have to just sort of like remind myself like it's going to be fine. Yep. It's going to be fine. And I, and that's a learning process for me is to quiet my mind when it gets out of control like that and just remind it that it's going to be fine. Like you've always been fine. You, you come up with solutions if there's a problem and you'll deal with it. Yep.

Debbie: ( 43:35)
Exactly. Exactly. Everything is figureoutable, right.

Kate: ( 43:40)
It really is. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Debbie: ( 43:43)
That's awesome. Well, I love, I love hearing about your projects and the success you've had and mainly I love that you love it because I think that when you're doing something you love so much, like it's just such a great feeling. It feels so good and it doesn't mean that problems don't come up and things don't feel scary and some days are harder than others. It's just a different feeling when you are totally loving what you do.

Kate: ( 44:18)
It really is. It feels so joyful. Yeah. I did some things, so it's so fun to share. You know, people love to see the before and afters, something that anyone can appreciate. It cause a lot of have jobs where you really don't know what they're doing. You know, if they're doing some kind of strategy or something on their computer and they're, they're doing tough work but it's like hard for people to know what they're doing. But this is a fun part of my job to share with people and they can just get it and it's fun. It's a fun part of my life. Other people enjoy [inaudible] as well.

Debbie: ( 44:55)
Yes, they do. People love hearing about and seeing before and after photos they loved, they love talking about it. Right.

Kate: ( 45:04)
Yeah, absolutely. And it's just so fun. I love him too.

Debbie: ( 45:09)
I know, I know.

Kate: ( 45:12)
I love a good makeover.

Debbie: ( 45:14)
Yeah. Is there any advice that you would give, would you, that you would give to a first timer who maybe they really want to flip houses and they're scared or anything like that before? Before I let you off the phone?

Kate: ( 45:32)
I mean, I would probably say exactly what you would say, which is just gotta go for it. Yeah. I mean, it's very, very awesome and fulfilling and you know, if you have that interest in it, do a little research, get yourself, you know, get, get yourself in a place where you feel you have enough knowledge that you can just get started and know that the whole thing will be a learning experience. But it's, you know, it's putting you in the right direction towards your dreams. Yeah, totally. The only way to learn is to just go for it.

Debbie: ( 46:05)
You gotta do it.

Kate: ( 46:06)
The thing in life,

Debbie: ( 46:07)
you're welcome. Do it. Yup. You got rip off,

Kate: ( 46:11)
problems will come up. It's inevitable, but you just figure it out. [inaudible] yes. It's ultimately really fun. And so yeah, I would just say go for it.

Debbie: ( 46:20)
Awesome. Well thank you so much for spending this time with me and I just, I love hearing your stories and again, I just, I appreciate you taking the time out to share your stories with us.

Kate: ( 46:40)
Well, I, I have just been delighted talking with you and I want to thank you again for placing your ad in front of my face at the right moment because I don't know what triggered this whole career change.

Debbie: ( 46:53)
I love it. I love it you, that makes you so happy. That does. It makes me so happy. The ripple effect. I love it.

Kate: ( 47:03)
Oh, it really is. Yeah. Yup.

Debbie: ( 47:04)
Yeah. Well thank you again. Kay. I'm sure I'm going to ask you to come back on when you finished your next three projects over the next year. Again, I'm like, you're on fire. I am. I love it. And I look forward to seeing pictures of your, of your next project that you're about to list next week.

Kate: ( 47:25)
I will be placing them on the Facebook page.

Debbie: ( 47:28)
Awesome. How can we get people to reach out to you if they need a realtor in the Portland area?

Kate: ( 47:39)
Um, it's very easy. You can just either visit my website at [inaudible] dot com or you can email me@kateatcatefulford.com

Debbie: ( 47:52)
and then we can go from there. Super simple. And I will link to those, those in the show notes so people can reach out to you. All right. Well, wonderful. Thank you again for your time and for sharing your stories and your inspiration. I know that people are going to hear this and feel inspired, so thank you for that. Thank you so much, Kay. Have a great rest of your day. All right, you too. Bye bye. Thanks. Bye. Doesn't that make you just want to go out and flip a house? I know, right? Okay. Well, speaking of which, we recently closed on our latest project. Gosh, just a few days ago, we closed on it and you can be a fly on the wall as we eat. Renovate this house. Okay, so I'm partnering up with two local students, two women who are in my coaching program and tribe and we are renovating a house together.

Debbie: ( 48:49)
All right. You will get all kinds of live coverage and behind the scenes and tips and tools and strategies that are just going to be valuable. Okay. Go to follow that flip.com I'll also share that link in the show notes. Again, follow that flip.com and register to be notified anytime I drop a new video or send out a new tool or share something with you. Okay. I think it's going to be about a five week project and I will share one to two videos each week with you, okay. And hundreds of information. All right. I hope to share that journey with you. All right? Go out there, flip houses like a girl and make it a great day. Bye y'all.

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